FULL TRANSCRIPT: Please note this transcript was generated by AI and may contain errors. 

00:00:01:04 – 00:00:31:18

This is the Portrait System podcast, a show that helps portrait photographers and people hoping to become one, navigate the world of photography, business, money and so much more. We totally keep it real. We share stories about the incredible ups and the very difficult downs when running a photography business. I’m your host, Nikki Closser. And the point of this podcast is for you to learn actionable steps that you can take to grow your own business and also to feel inspired and empowered by the stories you hear. This week’s club house guests with Ashleigh Taylor and Kevin Conde is Kate Styles.

00:00:31:26 – 00:00:51:08

You might actually remember Kate from our first one thousand dollar sales episode. And Kate is back to chat with you about her growth since that episode, her marketing, her black and white style, and also about her money blocks. This is a great episode with some awesome questions from the audience. And thank you again to our hosts Ashleigh and Kevin. And here they are with Kate.

00:00:52:08 – 00:01:22:10

Welcome, everyone, to the Portrait System podcast, clubhouse edition. My name is Kevin Conde and I’m here with my co-host, Ashleigh Taylor. If you are not familiar with the portrait system, we are a portrait photography podcast that is powered by Sue Bryce Education. Nikki Closser host our regular Monday episodes, and Ashley and I co-host our clubhouse edition, which is live here on the clubhouse app every Friday at noon Pacific. And then our episodes are released on Thursdays. You can tune in on your favorite podcast app by searching for the portrait system.

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And Ashleigh, how are you today?

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I am a great Kevin.

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I am so excited to be here cohosting our

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chat again with you today. And I’m so excited to introduce

00:01:33:15 – 00:01:43:14

our guest for today. Kate Styles is a Virginia based portrait photographer. Welcome, Kate. Hi. Thank you. I’m so excited to be here, guys.

00:01:44:00 – 00:02:09:23

Welcome to the podcast. Kate, Ashley and I are super excited to have you on today. When we look for guests, we want to go ahead and look for people that are within the civil rights community that are killing the game. So you have left a voicemail that became part of Nikki Closser main portrait system podcast where you talked about making your first one thousand dollar plus sale.

00:02:11:11 – 00:02:14:04

Yes, I remember that so clearly, too, isn’t that.

00:02:14:06 – 00:02:14:21

Funny,

00:02:16:22 – 00:02:39:26

if I may. You found Sue, you learned the content, and you moved into in-person sales in twenty nineteen. Since then, you went from a spare bedroom in your home to your garage to a commercial studio in twenty twenty to signing a new lease on an upgraded studio that you’re going to be going into this September.

00:02:40:11 – 00:02:42:03

Yeah that is exactly right.

00:02:43:07 – 00:03:03:02

You have three associate photographers and last year as of August 2020, you were booked for the remainder of the year, finishing with ninety eight sessions during a pandemic. Oh yeah. Yeah. You’re currently seven months pregnant now with two little ones at home.

00:03:03:22 – 00:03:06:19

Yeah. That is one hundred percent my life right now.

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Wow.

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Wow. You must be exhausted.

00:03:13:10 – 00:03:22:26

You know, I definitely say running your own business full time and having little babies at home is not for the not for the weak. That is for sure.

00:03:22:28 – 00:03:29:06

Not for the faint of heart at all. Geez, that is very impressive. Thank you.

00:03:30:22 – 00:03:52:00

So before we get into everything, I want to go ahead and with all that information I just spit out, let’s go ahead and just kind of talk about your numbers that you’ve been having. So let’s just start off. How many shoots are you currently doing a month for yourself and for your studio? I know you have the associates photographers as well. How many are you doing and how many are they doing?

00:03:52:11 – 00:04:06:04

Yeah, absolutely. So I shoot between eight and ten sessions a month and my associate photographers each have their own niche that they focus in and each of them usually book one to two a month.

00:04:07:11 – 00:04:14:22

OK, so it’s kind of it’s a smaller. OK, how about what are you doing average. What is your average sale per session.

00:04:15:01 – 00:04:18:10

I have a twenty eight hundred dollars average sale per session.

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That is awesome.

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amazing.

00:04:23:12 – 00:04:31:15

Thank you. Thank you. I love it. Twenty twenty. During the pandemic. One hundred percent shaped my business to what it is now.

00:04:32:19 – 00:04:41:15

Why do you think that that was like where you know, it was a harder year for them. Why do you think that that year was so game changing for you.

00:04:42:00 – 00:05:05:27

So for me, my husband actually got laid off during all of it. And at that time my husband and I were kind of making the same amount, and it was one of those either I have to make it or break it. At this point, I don’t have a choice. It was I have to pay the bills with this money and get this business rolling how I want it, or we’re not going to make ends meet.

00:05:05:29 – 00:05:19:05

I love that determination because sometimes it can be like motivational, the fear, but sometimes it can be crippling almost to have that kind of pressure. So I love that for you. You turned it into a big motivational factor.

00:05:19:21 – 00:05:36:16

Yeah, absolutely. And truly, I am so thankful my husband was one hundred percent supportive on, Look, babe, you love this, you’re nailing it. Just go for it. And in the middle of the pandemic, I went and signed a commercial space. People might think that’s crazy,

00:05:37:05 – 00:05:38:27

but was it a better deal?

00:05:38:29 – 00:06:03:08

Because I assume a lot of places were moving out of their spaces. And I, I don’t even know if it was a better deal or not. But I just knew for me when I was expecting these prices from my clients and inviting them into my two car garage, I was like, OK, this can’t keep happening. I need to find a space where it has air conditioning and a toilet. Oh

00:06:05:02 – 00:06:24:27

yeah. People coming into my garage, which had two AC units in the windows, and they would have to trip over my children and goldfish to get to the… Oh, I’m so sorry, my mom life, I’m leaving for Boston in an hour, so I have both my kids. So that’s OK.

00:06:26:18 – 00:06:45:27

So let’s back up and can you kind of give us a breakdown of your pricing and your packages? Because I know that that’s the big question that a lot of people have, is how to price themselves, how to get that average sale to twenty eight hundred, because obviously your prices have to lead people toward spending that much money.

00:06:46:22 – 00:07:08:27

Yeah, absolutely. So this year my session fee is four hundred and fifty dollars. That includes the make over and the photo session itself with three to five wardrobe changes. And then on top of that, they actually have a two hundred and fifty dollar credit to spend on any collection that they would like, it does not apply to ala carte

00:07:10:19 – 00:07:18:24

Forcing them to basically. But you’re incentivizing them to move in that higher direction, which then creates a greater sale for you.

00:07:19:10 – 00:07:36:22

Yes, exactly. So you have this two hundred fifty dollars credit and you can spend it towards any collection that they want. My collections start at a thousand. My middle collection is twenty one hundred and my top is thirty two hundred. And that’s before they apply the credit.

00:07:38:07 – 00:07:42:06

OK, so really, it’s two hundred fifty dollars less than whatever those

00:07:42:08 – 00:07:56:24

price is, correct? Exactly. And everyone always seems to forget that until they come into the reveal. And I’m like, remember, you have two hundred fifty dollars to spend on any of these collections and all of a sudden that thirty two hundred comes down to twenty nine fifty and they’re like, oh

00:07:58:21 – 00:08:00:15

so that’s really nice.

00:08:01:27 – 00:08:07:15

So with such a high average, by the sound of it, most people are hitting that highest package.

00:08:08:10 – 00:08:16:17

Yes, I yeah, most of the time I very I think I’ve sold my bottom collection maybe three times this year.

00:08:18:03 – 00:08:22:04

Not often. So they usually always either take the middle or the top.

00:08:22:23 – 00:08:28:23

What is the bottom one include? Like how do you essentially de-icentivize people to buy the bottom package?

00:08:28:25 – 00:08:46:15

So the bottom package comes with eight images. And because I mainly specialize in boudoir, I offer albums and it comes with eight images in an album. But when they come into my reveals, they’re looking at 60, 60 or so images to choose from. And that’s a lot.

00:08:47:17 – 00:08:48:28

Yeah. It must be hard to whittle it down.

00:08:49:10 – 00:08:49:25

Yes.

00:08:51:01 – 00:09:15:08

And it’s interesting that you mention that because we’ve had several guests on in the last few weeks and a lot of them have actually mentioned showing more than the standard twenty to twenty five images and saying that by showing a lot in this kind of fifty to one hundred range, obviously every person is different, but by doing that they’re getting these higher sales because they’re just showing so many great images.

00:09:15:21 – 00:09:42:12

Yeah. Essentially I when I first started doing this with boudoir, I was showing my clients like one hundred and ten images, which is exhausting. And for me, I noticed one of the things, especially in twenty twenty one, one of my goals was to really start working on my editing skills and fine tuning the skin textures with frequency, separation, et cetera, and doing that for one hundred, ten images is absolutely mind blowing.

00:09:43:25 – 00:09:47:29

So you’re retouching every single image. One hundred and ten.

00:09:48:23 – 00:09:56:22

I was yes. In twenty, twenty now in twenty, twenty one. I usually show my clients anywhere between forty five to sixty images.

00:09:57:18 – 00:09:58:24

And you are retouching

00:09:58:26 – 00:10:12:21

those if I’m understanding that correctly. Yes I retouched almost everything. I was outsourcing for a little while, but my goal has actually been to teach my studio manager to start retouching for me so she can take that on.

00:10:13:11 – 00:10:14:20

That’s awesome.

00:10:15:22 – 00:10:16:21

Thank you. I mean

00:10:18:27 – 00:10:38:07

when we when Kevin and I hear about growth like this in someone’s story, like a really fast transformation because twenty nineteen is only two years ago, we always want to like, wonder if, you know, if you had a money blocks that you’ve dealt with and how were you just so easily

00:10:38:09 – 00:11:10:00

able to grow in such a quick amount of time. Oh my gosh. Money blocks. I could talk about money all day and I joke about this all the time. I love talking with people about money and money and their business, because if we are if we would stop being so fearful about talking about money, we would make more money. So one of the big things I talk about to people that ask me questions about money, I grew up in a very normal family, but I had a lot of siblings.

00:11:10:02 – 00:11:42:13

My parents made decent money, but there wasn’t a ton to go around because I was one of four siblings and we all did extracurricular activities. So there wasn’t a lot of money to go around. So one of the biggest blocks that I came into starting this was, well, how am I supposed to ask for money like they have other things that they have to take care of. They probably have bills to pay. But then recognizing that I am very worth what I’m charging, Number one and two repeating numbers out loud is one hundred percent.

00:11:42:15 – 00:11:54:24

That confirmation of this is my business. I am who I am. And I always, always, always, always tell any other business owners you need to repeat your prices out loud. It’s the best thing you can do.

00:11:55:16 – 00:12:23:05

I am a hundred percent agree with that. When I first started, that was like the main thing I did was look in the mirror or see my prices. I also had an accountability partner and we would call each other and do like fake phone calls with each other and say our prices to each other. And it just made it so much less scary to practice like that instead of just seeing it. Cold customers as they would call.

00:12:23:16 – 00:12:37:02

Yes, absolutely. And that’s just like one of a handful that I know I had to work through. But like you said, just talking about those numbers out loud over and over, I love the fact that you did it with a friend. I never thought of that. That’s awesome.

00:12:38:15 – 00:12:41:14

Thanks. Yeah, it was it was a really powerful experience.

00:12:41:26 – 00:12:42:25

That is awesome.

00:12:43:06 – 00:12:55:12

Yes. Can you go a little bit deeper into the… you talk about money. You have the ability to make more money than after that. Is it just a matter of talking about prices and being able to get comfortable or is there more to that?

00:12:55:23 – 00:13:22:03

I definitely… There’s definitely more to that. I feel like money is kind of like an onion. You have to peel back the layers as you go, and one of the cool things, the sound really funny, I actually used to be a counselor for kids and one of the things that you go through is all the counseling and the therapy and learning about money blocks and then applying it to what I learned from therapy was like mind blowing.

00:13:23:24 – 00:13:39:23

So like learning your parents, like, engrain these things into your head that you’re so unaware of because you’re so little and then you’re practically practicing them as an adult because that’s all you know, and recognizing where those need to break away in order for your business to grow.

00:13:40:15 – 00:13:43:07

So what is your biggest money block and how did you overcome it?

00:13:44:05 – 00:14:16:05

Mine was the fear of asking for money because my parents did not have a ton of money growing up. We had just enough to get by. And so for me, reaching that thousand dollar goal was like, oh, my gosh, I can’t believe I’m about to ask this lady for a thousand dollars for her pictures. And I know that they’re beautiful, but she has kids at home. She has a house to pay for and all of a sudden breaking through that barrier was mind blowing for me. But again, it was a matter of practicing out loud my money.

00:14:16:07 – 00:14:36:28

And 2 when you’re in that reveal salesroom, you have to be quiet. You have no clue what that client is thinking right now. They could be sitting there thinking, oh, my gosh, let me transfer this money out of my savings account. I can put half of that on a credit card. You have no clue what they’re thinking. So you just have to shut your mind off and accept the money that’s flowing into your business.

00:14:37:16 – 00:14:53:17

I love that. So what about money leaks? Because those are different than money blocks. Obviously, you can still take a huge toll on our business. Did you have any money leaks that you needed to fill up, plug up?

00:14:55:08 – 00:15:29:25

You know, I I’m sure there are some that I’m not thinking of at the moment. I have to say, when I first started my business full time, my daughter, I just had my daughter at the end of twenty eighteen. I’d already been doing shoot-and-burn for a while, but it was like, OK, this is my business, I need to make money in this. I had fifteen thousand dollars in credit card debt like it was absolutely insane. And so money for me didn’t necessarily come because there wasn’t time to have leaks yet.

00:15:30:03 – 00:15:42:17

I’m actually at a point now in my business that I’m really having to fine tune where I’m spending my money. Is this money right here going to make my business grow or am I just spending it because I want to?

00:15:43:09 – 00:16:18:29

I totally hear that. I mean, one thing that Sue always talks about in her money leaks videos is that question of what makes the ship go faster. But I know for myself, like I can kind of justify things making the ship go faster even if they they don’t like for example, I could say, oh, I need this gown or these angel wings, then everyone’s going to want to book me to shoot in them. And that’s kind of true. But it’s also like kind of not when you’re spending way too much money on wardrobe, which was something I needed to correct a couple of years ago.

00:16:19:01 – 00:16:25:12

So did you have any, like, you know, tendencies like that that you’ve noticed with yourself?

00:16:26:25 – 00:16:34:20

Sometimes, yes. As far as I love purchasing my own work to put on my studio walls, does that sound crazy?

00:16:35:04 – 00:16:39:00

like studio samples. I mean, that makes a ship go faster, right?

00:16:39:04 – 00:16:41:19

That’s exactly how I feel. I just I mean, that’s

00:16:41:27 – 00:16:49:12

just fine, right? That’s then you can show it off. That’s how you justify it. OK, I’ll spend four years. Might as well

00:16:50:21 – 00:17:04:02

that that’s exactly how I feel. And it’s so funny because I had to truly sit down and talk with myself. I’m moving into this new beautiful studio space and I have all this wall space. I was like, do I really need to spend a thousand dollars on the wall art?

00:17:04:15 – 00:17:05:16

Yes. Yes, you do.

00:17:06:24 – 00:17:09:00

I did. I’m not going to lie. I totally did.

00:17:11:04 – 00:17:32:18

I mean, for myself, like even just today, there was like a course for something for like retouching today. And I was like, do I need this? Do I need one? Digging deeper into retouching. So I was like, you know what? We had previous guest that say that investing in your education is worth it. So, OK, OK,

00:17:34:12 – 00:17:37:28

Pricey but where’s my credit card at. Purchase

00:17:39:27 – 00:17:42:11

Right, exactly.

00:17:43:00 – 00:18:13:05

I think that’s the hardest thing is I mean, I always think education is the best investment because it will always I mean, you can almost always take something to grow from out of that. And in self-development, I think those are really valuable. But at the same time, it can be hard to know. Like what? Is the thing you need the most in this exact moment, and like I’ve been in business for over ten years and I still struggle at the end of the year, like there will still be purchases I made that.

00:18:13:07 – 00:18:24:22

I was like that wasn’t that wasn’t the smartest I probably could have, like used some self-control over that. So money leaks is still still a powerful one for me.

00:18:26:12 – 00:18:36:26

OK, what advice, if you can go back, would you give to yourself about dealing with your own money blocks and how you can go ahead and getting over that hurdle

00:18:37:09 – 00:18:55:00

so you’re going to laugh and this sounds very funny, but forgiving your parents for ingraining it and you when you were younger and like recognizing they didn’t know any better. I know that sounds so simple, really, but just forgiving them for doing that,

00:18:55:24 – 00:19:20:18

it’s some of the simple like, as you say, the simplest information that is sometimes just the most impactful because it’s sitting right there in front of you like, oh, forgive your parents. But when you really think about that bit of information and like understanding that they are, you know, they probably did their best, but by teaching you certain things, but by you know, they might have done it incorrectly.

00:19:20:27 – 00:19:21:26

But, yeah,

00:19:22:12 – 00:19:31:10

letting that go gives you the opportunity to then move forward and not having it be an anchor for your future business self.

00:19:31:19 – 00:19:35:06

Yep. Exactly. Exactly.

00:19:36:26 – 00:19:51:08

Thanks. I’m glad that you got that golden nugget. I’m telling you, had it not been for the money blocks and then the therapy, I would have never thought to put two and two together. But since moving through that, it just opens the doors, like you said, for this incredible opportunities.

00:19:51:26 – 00:20:26:05

I also wanted to ask you about I mean, you’ve you’ve had so much tremendous success in such a short period of time. And I know that when I’ve hit new levels in my business, I think it was Sue said this to me once, like new level, new devil, where you hit this new level and you have all this like former you would be so proud of all the success you’re having. But now at this new level, you’re kind of like faced with sometimes it’s almost like a version of the same problem, but it’s like showing up in a new way or maybe it’s a new problem altogether.

00:20:26:07 – 00:20:39:07

So I was just wondering if you’ve experienced this new level, new devil, and how you’ve dealt with some of potentially the new blocks or issues or fear that you’ve come up against as you’ve grown?

00:20:39:19 – 00:21:02:08

Oh, my gosh. Yes. Another level, another devil is one hundred percent accurate. So it’s definitely one of those things. My next level, the first one that I can really think of is getting an accountant and making sure I was charging sales taxes correctly. What I was supposed to be charging sales taxes on and paying those quarterly taxes like that was a huge level.

00:21:03:10 – 00:21:18:12

Is that something that you did like right off the bat, or did you feel like you needed to gain momentum with your business, gain a few clients under your belt before you decided to jump in to an accountant? Or it was like, boom, I don’t want to do this myself. Someone else do it for me?

00:21:18:24 – 00:21:34:01

No. So I went and got an accountant when I finally was getting close to hitting six figures in my business because it was like, I don’t want the IRS and coming and knocking on my door because I messed up on accident. So I definitely had some momentum going before I got one.

00:21:34:03 – 00:21:45:06

Before you were was it was it you’re doing it? Were you putting all that information to into like a CRM or quick books or were you having someone else, like an associate do it for you?

00:21:45:24 – 00:22:01:13

Nope. So I did everything I use honey book. I’m sure you guys have heard of it for my CRM and then I also can integrate it with my quick book. So I have both of those and I was really, really helpful. I’m so sorry my two year old is just not having it right now.

00:22:02:10 – 00:22:02:27

No worries.

00:22:03:15 – 00:22:23:05

So I was wondering, what advice could you give new photographers? I know you talked a little bit about seeing their prices out loud, but beyond that, what advice could you give photographers who are just kind of delving into money blocks about how to discover, like, what their block might be and then how to push past them?

00:22:24:05 – 00:23:00:24

Definitely. First, starting out, other than just repeating your prices, is truly diving in like feet first. There is there’s no I can’t… I don’t know exactly, but there’s really no wrong way to do something. And you’re going going to figure out those bumps as you go, but you’re never going to figure out those bumps until you start them and then you’ll start getting into like, oh, this actually doesn’t quite work how I was hoping I need to go ahead and get this fixed, but just dive in feet first and then you’ll start to unravel those blocks, that is.

00:23:00:27 – 00:23:16:15

Really helpful, do you think that people can journal or like how you know, how what kind of tangible activities can people do feel like kind of process through what they’re experiencing when they’re stuck?

00:23:17:00 – 00:23:52:00

If you are an introvert? I definitely recommend journaling, writing things down, talking about things. I am one hundred percent an extrovert, and I’m very thankful I have a smaller masterminds’ group here in the Richmond, Virginia area and just narrowing down with one person to be, hey, this is what I’m dealing with right now. Can you talk with me through this so I can understand it better? Because for me hearing things out loud and hearing myself talk about them and using a good entrepreneur, or friend as a sounding board is more beneficial for me.

00:23:52:20 – 00:24:25:28

I totally get that. I think that, like, talking out loud to process things is really powerful. I also like journaling, but I find that there are two different ways of processing through a problem. And then I’d also agree that having a group of local business owners that you can sound board off is incredibly powerful. Way to realize like, hey, there might be an easier way out of this problem than I see right now. Or the answer might be right in front of me, because sometimes I feel like we’re really great at solving other people’s problems.

00:24:26:00 – 00:24:34:13

But our own problems seem too big for us. Having like someone else is so

00:24:34:15 – 00:24:58:09

funny and the people around you just got to be sure that they’re willing to tell you it like it is like through the Sue Bryce Education Facebook by creating my own accountability group. And there’s times where I’m like, I’m trying to get through or I’m trying to kind of give an excuse. And they’re like, no, Kevin, this is how it’s got to be. You’re doing this incorrectly. You’re you’re you’re scared of this.

00:24:58:11 – 00:24:59:17

Yes, absolutely.

00:25:00:04 – 00:25:00:19

You’re right.

00:25:01:09 – 00:25:07:19

Have those people that are going to call you out on your bluff, I agree.

00:25:07:21 – 00:25:36:27

And the SBE members group is such a fantastic community because I really do think everyone in there does hold each other so accountable. And there are so many inspirational stories of success. I know in the last few days there have been a flurry of people who have already hit over one hundred K in sales just this year. And we’re only in July. And I always find stories like that so impressive in the group and just it helps me stay motivated and accountable as well.

00:25:37:14 – 00:25:50:14

Yes, I love reading those success stories just because I remember my own. And it’s just I love seeing other people succeed and what they’re doing. And you can just feed off of that motivation and excitement. Totally.

00:25:51:06 – 00:26:24:16

So we have reached that great point in the conversation where we can open it up to audience questions. So just a reminder, if you are listening and you have a question, hit the hand button in the lower right hand corner of the screen and we can bring you up on stage so you can ask your question to Kate or also myself and Kevin if you want. We always really love when you all engage. It just makes the conversations that much more powerful. So don’t be shy and don’t wait till the last second because some of you have a habit of doing that.

00:26:24:18 – 00:26:27:20

And we want to get your questions while there’s time.

00:26:29:12 – 00:26:34:14

So why don’t we transition into talking a little bit about marketing?

00:26:36:04 – 00:26:50:01

So when you were first starting out, what was the way that you attracted your very first clients? Because I think that that is something that people really struggle with, is just getting those first few people to get that momentum to get going.

00:26:51:04 – 00:26:58:18

So I will be frank, I did do the shoot-and-burn for a couple of years before I did kind of have that baseline clientele.

00:27:00:06 – 00:27:31:14

But when you first start sharing what you’re doing on social media is one hundred percent the driving key that worked for me because I was fresh out of high school and I had all these friends in college and we wanted to go out and take pictures and have fun. My work was extremely just like this girl got a little shoot-and-burn or point-and-shoot camera didn’t really know quite how to work it, but we were working with the ISO anyway. But then as you just get so excited, you grow.

00:27:31:27 – 00:27:57:27

And then what I found Sue Bryce and was like, oh my gosh, this is the work that I know I need to be creating. It was model call after model call of those clients that had already spent some money with me and me. Practicing lighting and posing and speaking and guiding people into the poses was huge. And every time I had a session, it went and got posted on social media every single time.

00:27:58:20 – 00:28:39:01

So I love that you said that your first people were from your shoot and burn days because of a huge question that gets asked in the group. A lot is like, oh, what I’m raising my prices and I’m changing my business model and I can’t possibly go back to my old clientele and tell them that now it’s going to cost a thousand dollars or fifteen hundred dollars or whatever. So can you talk a little more specifically about how you approached them and reeducated your clients into your new pricing and how you were doing things? And I mean, maybe I’m not sure if you I assume you charged a little from the model calls based on what it sounded like, but if you could just explain a little bit more detail.

00:28:39:12 – 00:29:13:08

Yeah, absolutely. For me, I did not charge for the model calls because I specifically reached out to clients that I had had in the past that had invested money with me and spent like two hundred dollars and saying, hey, I’m changing my business model. I loved working with you. I’d love if you would just come in and be a body for me to practice on. And I’m happy to let you purchase any images that you love. Now at the time. I think I was charging like sixty dollars an image when I first started my IPS, because again, you’re just testing out the bumps in the road to see how you feel about things, how you want to run things.

00:29:13:28 – 00:29:46:08

And I remember the very first client I brought in spent about five hundred dollars on her pictures afterwards and I was like, wow, OK, like this is going to go somewhere, but don’t be afraid to reach out to your past clients. If they turn you down, they just simply turn you down. And what are you here 10 no’s to get that one yes. That the people are going to spend money for you. And at the end of the day, even if they don’t buy any of their portraits, especially if your portfolio building, you have just done yourself a huge favor by learning on this person’s body.

00:29:46:15 – 00:29:54:29

They let you photograph them and then you can use their images again to hopefully share on social media and attract potential clients that you really do want to shoot.

00:29:56:02 – 00:30:03:25

So you will take the images from those bases, basically photo shoots and then remarketing them where and how,

00:30:05:10 – 00:30:42:00

mainly on social media. Facebook is huge for me as well as Instagram. And then I’m very thankful for the fact that my sisters are also professional dancers. And so they had a lot of networking that they could do with me. And so they sent me a lot of clients. But one hundred percent posting on social media constantly. You’re going to feel like a robot over and over and over again repeating yourself. But it’s what attracts clients to you. And I think the new thing I’ve read now is that clients are people have to see things twenty times now before they will commit to something.

00:30:42:04 – 00:31:07:06

Twenty times as it used to be seven. That’s what the number used to be. And now it’s like twenty times like people really need that repetition to for it to sink in in terms of what you do. And it’s I think the more distracted people get with phone, social media, shorter attention spans, it’s almost like you have to get in front of them even more regularly to stay on top of their mind.

00:31:07:17 – 00:31:27:05

Absolutely. And I’m at a point, at least when I first started it was like this. Now I’m at a point in my business where 90 percent of my clients are client referrals. And so the posting on social media is just kind of like my icing on the cake. All of my clients kind of do my marketing for me. It’s amazing. It’s incredible.

00:31:27:27 – 00:31:58:05

So. One of the things I was going to point out is, like you’re saying, you’re posting images and you feel like it’s getting monotonous and your clients are seeing it. But the thing is, not everyone that follows you is on at the exact same time and not seeing the exact same content that you previously posted before. So you think is like the seventh image that looks the same as the previous six. The person that might potentially be buying from you is seeing it for the first time.

00:31:58:15 – 00:32:00:15

Yes, exactly. Exactly.

00:32:00:20 – 00:32:30:28

And also, Kevin, they might not even remember that they’ve seen like maybe they aren’t seeing it for the first time. But if it was five days ago that they saw an image from that shoot, they may not really remember. People don’t have that. Think about all the information that we all got every single day on the Internet. And we just don’t have the capacity to hold all of it in our brains. But I think as business owners, I mean, everyone is a little self interested or self obsessed. So we all think, you know, everyone’s paying so much attention to us.

00:32:31:00 – 00:32:32:12

But the reality is.

00:32:34:28 – 00:32:37:07

Yes, they have so much coming at them. Yeah, it’s true. It’s so true.

00:32:38:17 – 00:32:55:08

I wanted to ask you, Kate, about the referrals, because I think it’s so amazing that 90 percent of your clients are coming from referrals. Now, are you doing anything to educate or incentivize your clients to refer you business?

00:32:55:20 – 00:33:30:28

Yes, this is probably the most golden pivot point of my business. And I tell people all the time that are kind of they’ve been in business for a while and they’re like, wow, I’m not getting any inquiries. I’m like, you need to educate your clients on how to market for you. It’s going to take a load off. So my clients actually get a this is the primary method. I’ll tell you a little bit about it. But the my clients actually get a gift voucher on a picture of themselves that they can give out to all of their friends and family so they can post this on social media.

00:33:31:04 – 00:34:08:08

They can text it to their friends. I don’t care what they do with that gift voucher, but if they have a friend that wants to come book, they get one hundred dollars off their session fee. And in return, I gift my clients with an extra print on whatever collection they choose or, you know, just little gifts like that that they absolutely love. I had one client in twenty twenty send me 10 clients, and so I actually gifted her with a smaller portrait session, just like a smaller mini session as just a thank you, because that client just sent me probably about ten thousand dollars and

00:34:08:10 – 00:34:21:04

you’ll always know what client it was who referred them because they’re using their own image. Yes, exactly. INCENTIVIZES them to like look, my image, use my image. Oh, that’s brilliant.

00:34:21:13 – 00:34:30:29

Yes, I love it. So I get emails all the time with a screenshot of Hey, So-and-so Sent me to you and they sent me a little screenshot of the the client’s image. It’s so much fun. I love it.

00:34:31:29 – 00:35:02:21

I love that. And I know you also have a VIP group and that topic has come up so much in our clubhouse chat. And it’s also one that we continue to get questions about from listeners and from the members in the Facebook group about how do you how do you get engagement. I think a lot of people start a Facebook group and it’s kind of crickets and they’re like, you know, they’re just struggling and they’re like, I hear this works for other people, but it’s not really working for me.

00:35:02:23 – 00:35:06:01

So can you talk a little bit about how you do your Facebook group?

00:35:06:12 – 00:35:48:26

Yeah, I actually did not start my Facebook group until, like, maybe the beginning of this year. And truly, one of my other entrepreneur friends is like, I cannot believe that you don’t have one of these yet. You are so booming. You need to give a place for your clients to go and brag about themselves. And so one of the things that I started doing was I put together a Facebook group and everyone likes to do giveaways, which I do sometimes. But a lot of times what I like to do is offer the champagne parties or like right now I am offering smaller, intimate sessions for a grand opening at my new studio in September, which has everyone like freaking out.

00:35:49:05 – 00:36:21:24

They’re so excited, but talking with people in the group. And then on top of it, my associates also interact in that group and chat when I tend to get a little bit more busy and don’t necessarily forget, but I just don’t have time to go and post in the group. They will go and post things in the group and keeping things on brand for you. For me, my boudoir is not very sexualized. It’s very much more intimate, more portrait like. And so I make sure my clients keep everything boss-babe like.

00:36:21:26 – 00:36:38:24

They like a lot of the boudoir groups, which there’s nothing wrong with this. Please don’t think I’m. Frowning upon it, they post a lot of those sexual jokes, which is totally awesome. It’s hysterical, but it’s just not on brain for me. So keeping things on brand is very important for me.

00:36:39:20 – 00:36:41:28

I love that. I think that’s really important.

00:36:43:16 – 00:36:48:24

And it’s your six hundred plus members already.

00:36:48:29 – 00:36:49:20

Yes, and

00:36:49:22 – 00:36:52:03

I’ve only started in the beginning of the year.

00:36:52:07 – 00:36:56:28

Maybe I might have been like four or five months ago and I have six hundred members right now.

00:36:57:11 – 00:37:10:26

And so how are you getting people like that? Seems like a lot of growth in a short amount of time. So how are you getting people to be excited to join and how are they finding the group and how are people coming into it?

00:37:11:03 – 00:37:46:18

Yeah, so right now this is the second time I’ve done a giveaway in the group and there’s two things going on for the month of July. The first one is for the number one person to invite the most female friends so they can go on their group and invite all of their females are on their personal individual Facebook, invite all of their female friends, and then the second person to win also give a gift voucher towards the session is who’s going to interact the most in the group? And so it has everyone scrambling to add their friends.

00:37:46:24 – 00:37:54:09

They’re also talking to one another because they want to have the most interactions to get that gift voucher. And it’s a very, very fun to watch.

00:37:55:12 – 00:38:20:18

Well, that’s fine. If they’re using keeping on Brand, though, are you is there anyone monitoring that from from those people that are like, oh, I want to I want to talk. I want to be known as a person that is communicating with everyone. Is there anything keeping them from just saying like, hi and that’s it? Or as opposed to quality content or is that not something that you’re looking at? Just want people to interact?

00:38:21:13 – 00:39:06:25

So I did start when I started I started this about two months ago. I started doing an ambassador program, which is where I actually picked past clients that I absolutely just fell in love with. They were incredible to work with. They are very active on social media. They usually referred me at least one client and also keeping a very diverse portfolio. So I have four ambassadors technically in my group on Facebook is the goddess lounge. So they’re known as the goddess ambassadors and they each get a mini portrait session and we sit down and actually chat about my brand and what it means to me and what I am asking and requesting of them in return.

00:39:06:29 – 00:39:16:28

And so the rules for my ambassadors were very, very simple. I let them know about my brand, what’s important to me, keeping it very boss-babe like. like strong female

00:39:18:22 – 00:39:49:01

bosses. Anything like that magazines, makeup, I’m all about it. They got one mini session on me because what I wanted them to do was go in the group and post their own images. I want you to show off like these gorgeous pictures of yourself in this group. And then the other requirement was they were required to book their own session within six months, which they all did. And all of them have done an incredible job. I’m so thankful for them. And they only posted there like once a week.

00:39:49:09 – 00:39:57:29

And if they see clients that are like, oh, I really want to do this, but I’m not sure. Usually somebody jumps on it it’s like, girl, you’ve got to get on this like you will do. Incredible.

00:39:59:07 – 00:40:06:23

That’s awesome. You have so you have four women. They’re just helping sell your business within your Facebook group, that’s all.

00:40:06:25 – 00:40:21:22

Yep. Yep, exactly. It’s been wonderful. And again, I didn’t just go out and pick random people. These were clients that had been with me at least within the past twelve months. And you just connect this you almost to a point where you’re like, OK, we’re friends now. I can not part with you.

00:40:23:18 – 00:40:31:00

I love that. I am just obsessed with this goddess ambassador thing that you’ve talked about. And

00:40:32:26 – 00:40:38:12

I would like to know if you would ever cap the amount of ambassadors that you would have.

00:40:39:21 – 00:41:09:02

Probably just it might depend on years come for right now. Definitely. I have four and I love keeping it four and they’re only on a six month contract with me. So after that they can decide to stay with me or part ways, which is totally up to them and what’s going on in their life. I don’t know if I could probably do about ten, but I feel like keeping up with ten women is a lot because I want to make sure that they know how much I care about them and how thankful I am for them. So that would probably be my cap.

00:41:09:13 – 00:41:11:10

That makes a lot of sense. And

00:41:13:02 – 00:41:45:07

you said that you have a contract with them. So so you actually formalize this because I think this is really important. And sometimes even with something as simple as like just model shoots or model calls, photographers forget to get in writing the verbal agreement that two people have and then all of a sudden down the road, the client or model or whoever kind of changes their mind about how they want the images to be used or whatever. And I see this post come up in that realm a lot in the members only group.

00:41:45:19 – 00:41:53:06

So could you talk a little bit about, like, formalizing it and how you go over it in a way that it’s not intimidating, but it’s just very much setting your boundaries?

00:41:53:19 – 00:42:30:22

Yeah, absolutely. So I have them actually sign a legit contract. They get the contract. So what happens is I put out an application that they can apply to be one of the goddess ambassadors. And then when I feel when someone’s application comes in, I’ve looked at their social media. I’m like, yes, this is who I want. This is who, you know, I feel like would represent my brand very well. I bring them in and they get an email saying that they’ve been accepted as well as the rules and my rules are not super heavy, but it’s enough that says, hey, look, you know, I’m a portrait photographer.

00:42:30:24 – 00:42:51:06

it does not mean you get to go and shoot with other photographers and share their work for at least the next six months. I would love for you to just solely focus on helping me with my business. And here is what I’d like to do for you in return. And then we book their mini session where they come in. They get 10 to 15 images where they get to share them on their social media, to share them in the goddess lounge.

00:42:52:22 – 00:43:04:08

And when we do, there are many sessions. We then actually go over the contract again. I make sure they don’t have any questions or concerns and then they actually go ahead and sign it on my on my honey book. They get it right there.

00:43:05:01 – 00:43:08:06

That’s awesome. That’s so official. And I really like that

00:43:09:22 – 00:43:27:12

about it because I think a lot of people just forget to take that step and really formalize it. And then and then when those boundaries get crossed, it’s a whole sticky situation that could have been solved by just up front kind of preempting everything, which is formalising an agreement.

00:43:27:19 – 00:43:37:15

Yes, absolutely. Right now, I haven’t had anybody cross the line or do anything they haven’t supposed to. So I can’t say I’ve had any bad things happen yet. Thank goodness. Let’s knock on wood.

00:43:38:08 – 00:43:43:07

Yeah, that’s awesome. And also, of course, it’s picking people who really have a good feeling about.

00:43:43:16 – 00:43:45:07

Yes, exactly. Exactly.

00:43:45:21 – 00:44:12:00

So I wanted to ask you, you brought up the topic of mini sessions with your goddess ambassadors and other past clients, normally within Sus Bryce community. She doesn’t advise photographers do mini sessions, but the photographers will do them so they can charge less, not be scared and not receive what their artwork is worth.

00:44:12:08 – 00:44:13:14

Yes, but I’ve

00:44:13:16 – 00:44:25:25

seen that you do white sheet sessions. Are you working on wings? So I kind of tell me that. How how have these mini sessions worked out for you,

00:44:26:08 – 00:44:58:03

so the mini sessions for the Wings was probably the beginning of twenty twenty. I actually do not like using my wings anymore. That was solely… so I actually made my own wings. You guys all laugh because I’m a penny pincher. I literally ordered all my own ostrich feathers, my fabrics, everything, and made my wings. And it was truly to get people in the door to pay for those wing coverages and again, practice my IPS (in person sales). And this was before the pandemic even started last year.

00:44:59:09 – 00:45:13:11

Now I offer many sessions two times a year and I offer white sheet many sessions. I absolutely love doing this and I hate calling them mini sessions, but everyone just knows what they are. I try to use the words intimate sessions,

00:45:16:05 – 00:45:55:08

but everyone knows what a mini is and the white sheet for me. So they come in, they pay just a smaller session fee. They have thirty to forty five minutes in the studio and it actually still is an IPS to reveal. But the collections are smaller because they’re not looking as many images. So typically on average, my clients very many sessions spend seven hundred dollars. And if you can imagine putting four of those together in one day, that’s actually not too bad. But again, I know that’s something that I love doing because white sheets are universal on every woman’s body and everyone actually feels really comfortable because you’ve got something pressed against your skin.

00:45:56:28 – 00:46:01:18

So are you not including hair and makeup in that white sheet, the mini sessions,

00:46:02:00 – 00:46:32:17

they come in and they get a… We call it eyes, lips and cheeks, sometimes for the white sheets. So they’ll come in with their hair already curled and I’ll have a hair and makeup artist touchup eyes, lips and cheeks. And then they go on into the portrait session and that the the makeup takes like fifteen to twenty minutes. OK, but again, I love doing the white sheets like those ten years, like near and dear to my heart. I’m not sure why, but I just love them.

00:46:33:01 – 00:46:46:15

Do you find that it’s like a good kind of sampler offer where someone’s able to come in and sample your services at a lower price point and then it’s like, oh, I need this again, but I need it with all the fabulous I want it.

00:46:47:15 – 00:47:01:13

Yes. I literally had a client at the end of her mini session book herself a full boudoir session. She was like, I need to come back in here and do this again. And I actually saw her two weeks ago and she was like, I’m already buying the top package. You can just build me for it.

00:47:02:00 – 00:47:10:09

Oh, that’s awesome. Did you do anything like incentivize the mini session people to coming back? Like, do they get any special

00:47:10:22 – 00:47:45:02

deal or no special deals? But I do have to say from the very beginning, they walk in the door. My goal is to plant the seed in their head for them to come back. So I usually make comments like, Girl, I can’t believe you gave me this amount of time to work with you. Like, you’re so gorgeous. Why are you doing this to me? I need to photograph you again. I could see you in this and I’ll pull things out of my wardrobe and we’ll talk about how they want to be photographed. And truly, most of the time, either my clients book I fashion after that or their client that I’ve shot previously in the year.

00:47:45:04 – 00:47:54:14

And they’re just looking to do like an extra little something for themselves for Christmas. And they come in and do the white sheets because I actually only offer white sheet minis for Christmas and for Valentine’s Day.

00:47:55:07 – 00:48:04:08

Oh, OK. So they’re kind of actually close together in a way in the year before Christmas and Valentine’s Day are like annoyingly close together in my opinion.

00:48:04:22 – 00:48:05:14

Yes.

00:48:07:15 – 00:48:10:20

Everyone wants that excuse of oh, let me gift this to somebody.

00:48:11:03 – 00:48:19:03

So are people gifting them as gifts then, or is it just mainly clients that are past clients looking to have these little sessions?

00:48:20:15 – 00:48:24:10

It’s both. Yeah. It’s definitely a good mixture of both.

00:48:25:12 – 00:48:39:18

Now, are you only doing this like during the Valentine’s Day Christmas or the able purchase them around that time and then have them later on, or you keeping it all those necessities within a few days within that time frame?

00:48:39:28 – 00:49:11:00

Yep. So they’re always within the same day, within the same time frames. I usually will set aside one weekend and I’ll do four to five a day. But again I try and make it incentivized. Hey, this is Christmas. It’s time to treat yourself and offer the white sheet sessions. And then for Valentine’s Day, of course, everyone wants to gift their significant other something. But we us women already know that we do it for themselves. So they’ll come in and just giving the gift is like the icing on the cake for them to book.

00:49:11:28 – 00:49:17:07

Do these are they the same products or the digital images that you’re doing for these?

00:49:17:23 – 00:49:42:20

So they’re different products. The top collection is six hundred dollars for these mini sessions, and it comes with one 11 by 14 print and then a I’m sure you guys have seen the accordion mini album and that’s what they get with that top collection. And then they’ll get all. Usually the top collection has 15 images and they’ll get their 15 digital images.

00:49:43:11 – 00:49:47:24

Awesome. So it really is like a pretty affordable investment for someone.

00:49:48:05 – 00:49:59:12

Yes, absolutely. Definitely not at the bottom of the barrel. But for me, it feels beautiful. And I get more clients in the door that way because like you said, they get that little taste.

00:50:00:05 – 00:50:01:04

Love it.

00:50:01:20 – 00:50:14:18

So I wanted to point something out that I saw on your on your Facebook that I thought was a pretty clever idea that you would point out that boudoir clients are not normally looking to purchase.

00:50:16:05 – 00:50:42:24

Yes, you shoot detailed shots during your sessions to potentially sell them metal prints for different rooms throughout their house. Yes, that’s correct. Can you speak on that? And are there any other types of shots that you’re creating during your session to happen to have an opportunity to sell to your client later on?

00:50:43:28 – 00:51:22:23

So one of the things that I love to do is when I’m doing my reveal session at the very end, I will put together three images side by side that you wouldn’t necessarily think to hang up in your house. However, seeing all three of those images side by side can look absolutely stunning. So if you have this gorgeous like my favorite thing to shoot is collarbones and spines. And if you have this gorgeous backlit silhouette and then you have the light trickling over the spine and then maybe just the fingers daintily sitting on a shoulder, having those three images side by side are like, whoa, wow, that looks gorgeous.

00:51:23:06 – 00:51:38:23

And so in my top collection, I also have that they have the option of purchasing a 16 by 20 metal print, which is what my favorite thing to sell is and what I love about the metal prints as they can hang them in their bathroom because the water is not going to destroy the image.

00:51:39:07 – 00:51:41:01

That’s a good point. I hadn’t even thought about that part.

00:51:41:17 – 00:51:52:17

Yeah, it’s awesome. My clients love them. I tried selling printed wall art and nobody was feeling it. I was like, OK, you got to stick with your metal print. So I was like, OK, I heard loud and clear.

00:51:55:06 – 00:52:01:12

Let’s see. By the looks of it, we do have a question. So, Sara, if you can unmute yourself and go ahead and ask a question.

00:52:02:03 – 00:52:34:24

Hi, thanks so much. This is my first time in Club House and my first time stepping forward. And Kate, I’m so inspired by everything that you’re talking about. And I was wondering I have two quick questions. One is for regarding your gift vouchers. You said that you personalized them by putting images of your clients on them. And I was just wondering, where do you… do you make those in Photoshop? Do you print them yourself or how do you do that and get that turn around quick? Yeah.

00:52:34:26 – 00:53:05:29

So the gift vouchers that my clients get I make right in Photoshop, I normally go through and cull and then pull like one of my favorite images, and usually of their face because they want to engage their audience. And I’ve just noticed that if you can find one where they’re really engaged with a camera, it’s beautiful. And then it has all of my information all over that gift voucher. So Kate Styles photography up in the top left hand corner. It says, like, lucky girl in the middle or lucky you. And then it has at the bottom where they can book me.

00:53:06:03 – 00:53:24:12

And then in the top right it says one hundred dollars off. Any friend of the client’s name is a friend of mine, so it’s personalized with their name on it. Nice. Thank you. And just really quickly, also, you are talking about the ambassadors. I thought that was genius. And so with your

00:53:24:14 – 00:53:25:11

ambassadors

00:53:25:13 – 00:53:56:08

and you said that you offered them. I think I think you said you offer them like fifteen images or around that or something like that. And is that prints and digitals or just digitals or how are you doing that. That is just something I give to them as a thank you digitally and mainly because I want them to use it to represent my brand. I want them to use those digitals to go post on their own. Social medias within my Goddess Lounge Facebook group on their LinkedIn wherever. So that’s kind of my get to them.

00:53:56:10 – 00:54:26:12

Like, thank you for marketing for me. Here’s marketing material. That’s perfect. So so if they wanted to purchase prints though, has anyone ever done that from those little sessions. So the one part about it is when I have the goddesses, they are required to book their own full session. Oh that’s OK. And so that’s where they go and purchase and they can purchase prints from their mini sessions if they choose. That’s totally fine with. But they are required to book their own full session. That makes perfect sense.

00:54:26:14 – 00:54:29:26

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Yeah, great question. Thanks, Sarah.

00:54:30:12 – 00:54:31:03

Sarah.

00:54:31:25 – 00:54:55:27

Well, we have hit that one hour mark, and it has been an absolute pleasure having you on with us. A lot of good information with and goddess ambassadors and Facebook, Facebook group and everything. Thank you very much. But before we let you go, if you can go ahead and please, please, please share your social media with those. Let people know where they can find you.

00:54:56:14 – 00:55:09:07

Oh, my gosh. Yes. And thank you so much for having me. This has been such an incredible pleasure. You can find me at Kate Styles photographer on Instagram, and then Kate Styles photography on Facebook or just Kate.

00:55:09:28 – 00:55:13:05

Thanks, Kate. Thank you so much. You’ve been an incredible guest.

00:55:13:19 – 00:55:16:02

Thank you. It’s been wonderful. Thank you,

00:55:16:15 – 00:55:54:07

everyone. Please go follow, Kate, and please also make sure to follow the portrait system on Instagram and on Facebook as well. Be sure to check out the blog posts associated with the clubhouse, interviews at Suebryceeducation.com/blog. If you are a member of SueBryce Education and you have any more questions for Kate, Ashleigh or myself, please tag us in a post in the SBE Member’s only Facebook group. And if you are not a member of Sue Bryce Education and you’re interested in learning more about how we can help your business succeed, please email Ella at support at SueBryceEducation.com.

00:55:54:12 – 00:55:57:15

And thank you again for joining us. And we hope you can join us next week.

00:55:58:09 – 00:56:02:04

Thanks. See you all next Friday. Thank you.

00:56:03:03 – 00:56:38:25

Thanks again for listening today. And don’t forget, you can listen to either me or our special guests every Friday on clubhouse at 11:00 a.m. Pacific.

Thank you so much for listening to the Portrait System Podcast. Your five-star reviews really help us to continue what we do. So, if you like listening, would you mind giving us a review wherever you listen? I also encourage you to head over to SueBryceEducation.com, where you can find all of the education you need to be a successful photographer. There are over 1,000 on-demand educational videos on things like posing, lighting, styling, retouching, shooting, marketing, sales, business, and self-value. 

There’s also the 90 Day Startup Challenge, plus so many downloads showing hundreds of different poses. We have to-do checklists for your business, lighting PDFs, I mean truly everything to help make you a better photographer and to make you more money. Once again, that’s SueBryceEducation.com.